Influential Palestinians Say It’s Time for a One-State Solution

It will be 20 years ago this September that Israeli and Palestinian leaders reached a historic Declaration of Principles, the forerunner to the Oslo Accords, which were intended to lead to a permanent peace deal between Israel and the Palestinians.

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Mohamad Torokman / Reuters

Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas attends a Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO) executive committee meeting in the West Bank city of Ramallah, on May 12, 2013.

It will be 20 years ago this September that Israeli and Palestinian leaders reached a historic Declaration of Principles, the forerunner to the Oslo Accords, which were intended to lead to a permanent peace deal between Israel and the Palestinians. The homestretch was yet to be negotiated, but what awaited at the finish was clear: a Palestinian state next to the Israeli one – a deal based on the concept of two states for two peoples.

Now, many here feel they’re simply running in place. Some of the most prominent members of Fatah, the mainstream faction of the PLO and the axis of power for Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, say the two-state solution is not longer viable. Instead, they’re campaigning for the creation of one democratic, secular state for Arabs and Jews, made up of Israel, Gaza and the West Bank. On May 15, about 30 of them signed a statement promoting this concept, launching a “Popular Movement for One Democratic State in Historic Palestine.”

Radi Jarai, a political scientist at al-Quds University, is one of those Fatah members who long supported the peace process, which US Secretary of State John Kerry is now in the region trying to revive. But Jarai, like most Palestinians, grew bitterly disappointed as he watched the possibilities of dividing the land disappear by the year.

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“We tried the two-state solution and it’s no longer realistic,” explains Jarai, one of the leaders of the one-state movement within Fatah. The one-state group is heavily weighted with university professors and other intellectuals. “We realized that the Israeli government, after the assassination of [Prime Minister] Yitzhak Rabin, has systematically worked in order to destroy the option of a two-state solution. Specifically, he says, the growth of settlements in the West Bank and Israeli building in East Jerusalem make it increasingly difficult to envision any contiguous tract of Palestinian land that could constitute a state alongside Israel.

“Abu Mazen [Abbas] negotiated for 20 years, and we find that every day we are farther away from a Palestinian state,” he adds. “Many Palestinians believe in this, as do some of our friends in Israel. Within this context, we are ready to live with the Israelis, with the Jews, without any kind of discrimination, in order to create one democratic state.”

Saeb Erekat, the chief Palestinian negotiator, is deeply troubled that some of his compatriots have bolted from Fatah’s vision. “I’m a Fatah Central Committee member and our position is two states, and to see some of my most respected colleagues sign on such a document and reorient our strategy to one state is very alarming,” he says. He blames the growth of settlements. “This is why we really want John Kerry to succeed,” Erekat adds. “When the highest elected people in Fatah sign such a document, which they did in defiance of the party strategy, it shows that people have lost hope in the possibility of two states.”

The idea appears to be a non-starter for most decision-makers in the Israeli mainstream, although it is being talked about on the left and right ends of the political spectrum, but often as more of bogeyman than a viable option. An official in Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s government said that they take such a proposal as a sign that Palestinians still don’t accept Israel’s right to exist. “That is the fundamental problem in the peace process,” says the official, speaking on condition of anonymity. “The Palestinian side still views the Jewish state as fundamentally illegitimate. They’re talking about peace without the Jewish state, and won’t find in us a parter for that.”

Proponents of the one-state plan say that rather than try to disentangle the Gordian Knot of people, communities, roads and services that already exists, everyone in Israel, Gaza and the West Bank should be given the same citizenship and live under a secular democracy. In fact, some on the Israeli right – including some maverick voices in the settlements – say they would prefer to become one binational state than to evacuate a few hundred thousand Jews from the West Bank. And just as many Israelis feel deeply tied to their ancient roots in the land they refer to exclusively by their biblical names, Judea and Samaria, many Palestinians find it hard to fathom ever agreeing to give up their deep attachment to the cities of the coastal plain, such as Acre, Haifa and Jaffa.

(MORE: Why Palestine Won Big at the U.N.)

“This movement is emerging because of the vacuum in negotiations,” says Quaddura Fares, a veteran Fatah member and former minister in the Palestinian Authority (PA). Fares also grew disillusioned; he left the PA and now runs the Palestinian Prisoners Association, a non-governmental organization. Fares still supports the two-state solution and isn’t a signatory to the new one-state document, but understands why it’s gaining momentum.

“This group is perhaps more realistic than the official leaders,” Fares muses. “We continue to act for a Palestinian independent state in the 1967 borders, but despite that, it became a joke for the Palestinians. The majority feel that there are no options, that every gate has been closed. People believe that even if we will act by violence again, with an intifada, it will only bring a more complicated situation for everyone and solve nothing.”

So is a one-state solution remotely realistic? Many Israelis say it’s the worst possible scenario, because it would seemingly spell the end of the Zionist dream. Demographers have long predicted that by the year 2020, the Jewish state would lose its demographic edge. At least one demographer argues that there are already more Arabs than Jews in total living in Israel, Gaza and the West Bank.

For over a decade, Israeli politicians have warned with increasing alarm that if they don’t arrive at a two-state solution soon, they will have missed the boat: Palestinians will demand a one-state solution instead, and will try to label Israel an apartheid state in the interim. Even rightist former Prime Minister Ariel Sharon used the demographic threat as the logic for pulling out of the Gaza Strip in 2005. It’s unclear as to whether Netanyahu feels equally moved by the demographic time bomb ticking at his door. But his Minister of Finance, Yair Lapid, closely watched as one of Israel’s new kingmakers, said in an interview with Israeli newspaper Yediot Aharonot this week that a there is nothing “more dangerous than a binational state.”

Barely a week goes by here without some pundit or politician raising the concept of a binational state, whether to embrace it – as has Ahmed Qurei (Abu Ala), a former Palestinian prime minister and one of the original Olso negotiators – or to insist, as did former Defense Minister Moshe Arens in a recent op-ed in Haaretz, that Israel already effectively is a binational state, a reference to the approximately 20 percent of Israeli citizens who are Arab. Arens says the answer is for the government to promote Jewish immigration to Israel, and hope that time is on their side.

“We have looked at this issue several times in the past,” says Tamar Hermann, a political scientist specializing in public opinion at the Israel Democracy Institute in Jerusalem. “The level of support among Israeli Jews is very low. It’s somewhere between five to eight percent at the most, and this is divided between the extreme right and the extreme left.” Moreover, she says, binational states have been tried in Belgium, Lebanon, Cyprus, “and in almost all cases it collapses, so it is known to be very unstable.”

The Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research found that just under a third of Palestinians, about 29%, support “a one-state solution based on equality for Arabs and Jews.” Over the past decade, according to pollster Dr. Khalil Shikaki, that figure has vacillated between 25 and 30 percent.

Diana Buttu, a lawyer and analyst who formerly worked on the PA’s negotiating team, thinks some of the momentum comes from utter frustration not just with Israel, but with the PA leadership. “Many are now feeling that the movement has shifted away from liberation and that Fatah is now quibbling over ministries and seats and so on,” she says. Buttu understands the anger of the Fatah leaders pushing the one-state plan, she says, “but I don’t feel that they will go very far as Fatah is very entrenched in its ‘negotiations until victory’ stance.”

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74 comments
drsar
drsar

The idea of creating a one democratic state (ODS) in Israel/Palestinians has been gaining momentum among Israeli-Jews and Palestinians who aim to restore justice, end segregation, racism, occupation and violence. Israeli-Jews and Palestinians have been meeting to discuss the ideals of ODS and produced many declarations and initiatives on ODS chiefly among them is the Munich Declaration for One Democratic State in Historic Palestine. The Munich Declaration of July 1, 2012 states:

One Democratic State (ODS) shall be established in the entire territory of historic Palestine between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River as one country that belongs to all its citizens including all those who currently live there and all those who were expelled over the past century and their descendants.

The country shall be an independent sovereign State in which all citizens enjoy equal rights and all can live in freedom and security.

ODS in Palestine will end ethnic cleansing, occupation and all forms of racial discrimination from which the Palestinian people suffered under Zionism/Israel.

The reunified Palestine shall be a democracy in which all of its adult citizens shall enjoy equal rights to vote, stand for office and contribute to the country’s governance. No State law, institution, practices or activities may discriminate among its citizens on the basis of background, color, gender, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status.

The State shall be based on separation between government and religion. It will not establish or accord special privilege to any religion; and shall provide for the free practice of all religions.

One of the primary objectives of the new state is to enable the Palestinian refugees to realize their right of return to all the places from where they were expelled, rebuild their personal life, and participate in creating the new state. Private property of Palestinian refugees shall be restored and restitution and compensation arranged. Restoring the rights of the Palestinians will be done while respecting the equal rights and protection of ALL citizens under the law.

Public land of the State shall belong to the nation as a whole and all of its citizens shall have equal access to its use. The natural and economic resources of the country shall benefit all of its citizens equally.

The State shall provide the conditions for free cultural expression by all of its citizens. It shall ensure that all languages, arts and culture can flourish and develop freely. All citizens shall have equal rights to use their own dress, languages and customs, and to express their cultural heritage free of insults or discrimination.

Citizens shall have equal access to employment at all levels and in all sectors of the society. Employment shall not be determined or restricted by language, race, religion, gender, or nationality. Education and vocational training shall not be segregated or specialized in any way that impedes equal access of all citizens to employment and other opportunities to fulfill their talents and dreams.

The State shall uphold international law and seek the peaceful resolution of conflicts through negotiation and collective security in accordance with the United Nations Charter. ODS will sign and ratify all international treaties on human rights and the people of a unified Palestine shall reject racism and promote anti-racism, social, cultural and political rights as set out in relevant United Nations covenants. The State shall seek and contribute to the establishment of a Middle East that will be free of all weapons of mass-destruction.

Tis vision is shared by all ODS supporters and current Declarations and Initiatives on the one democratic state option for the resolution of the Israel/Palestine conflict.  The time has come for this vision to be considered.  

HannoPhoenicia
HannoPhoenicia

Not a bad idea; Israel and Palestine as one country. Jerusalem cannot be trusted to either side, it should be an international city with neutral countries running it and allowing access to all holy sites to all religions. That proposal was made decades ago and it's still a valid one. A separation of religion and state is needed. When religion and politics are combined, as it is in the US, both are contaminated and corrupted. The US should follow it's Constitution and the Levant should have one.

gaguy1967
gaguy1967 like.author.displayName 1 Like

@HannoPhoenicia and who exactly is going to enforce this utopia? The idea that Muslims will accept a secular, democratic multicultural nation is absurd. They don't accept such a nation in Lebanon and not in Turkey either. Yet somehow they will live peacefully side by side with the Jews. A one party state is meant to lead to war.

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen like.author.displayName 1 Like

@gaguy1967 

It's a 'one party state' NOW.  One party has all the guns, all the F-16's, all the tanks, all the nukes, all the nuke-carrying, German-made Dolphin submarines, all the Cobra helicopters while the 'Muslims' are choked under the jackboot of their Israeli occupiers.  Only ONE party in the entire world thinks this is an acceptable state of affairs.  Guess which one.

azmalhome
azmalhome

Who those Muslim will go to suck the leg of non-Muslim powerful leader around when they got the trouble? The world’s popular media says “those are good Muslim”.

Quran 2: 120 “never will the Jews and the Christians approve of you until you follow their religion. Say, "Indeed, the guidance of Allah is the [only] guidance." If you were to follow their desires after what has come to you of knowledge, you would have against Allah no protector or helper.”

http://azmalhome.wordpress.com/2013/03/10/top-islamic-preacher-to-death-penalty/

kengross
kengross like.author.displayName 1 Like

And you of course, as TIME, are giving this blatant propaganda ploy the gravitas and exposure that it does not deserve.  You can always be counted upon to shaft the Zionist vision in any way you can.  Shame on you for being such tools of Muslimperialism.

HannoPhoenicia
HannoPhoenicia like.author.displayName 1 Like

@kengross  People like you are the reason why a theocratic, apartheid Israel exists. It's time to make this land a democracy with equal rights and all religions respected, but not put in control.

gaguy1967
gaguy1967 like.author.displayName 1 Like

@HannoPhoenicia @kengross Name a single muslim country that meets your bigoted standards. You don't accept a Jewish Israel but accept Theocratic Muslims nations. Youre nothing buy a Jew hater.

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen like.author.displayName 1 Like

@gaguy1967 @kengross 

"Jew hater"?  What are we if we think Israel has no right to blatantly carry out ethnic cleansing operations that are tantamount to slow motion genocide?  Your incessant whining about non-existent anti-Semitism is wearing awful thin.  With the hole Israel is in now, the first thing you and your ilk should do is STOP DIGGING!

Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky

Israel won this thing since repulsing 4+ pathetic Arab invasions of idiot soldiers... since that time the only group not hacking off limbs and stoning women to death is Israel.

Israel is the only place a man or woman can live without the fear of sharia idiots coming to take their heads... Nobody cares a wink for the loss of a Muslim state as the fewer the better

HannoPhoenicia
HannoPhoenicia

@Hadrewsky Israel lost it's last wars with Egypt and Hezbollah. 1967 was a long time ago, you're a bit behind the news. Your desire for another holocaust with you playing the Nazi role is duly noted.

gaguy1967
gaguy1967

@HannoPhoenicia @Hadrewsky Oh yes Eqyptian liar. You still think you won the 1973 War. The arabs are such liars.

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen

@gaguy1967

"The arabs are such liars".  In the next breath you no doubt switch to referring to anyone who would apply such am idiotic generalization to Jews as a 'Jew Hater', with remarkable agility.  Though I don't approve of the term, you would have a case.  So what does that make you?

When it comes to the '67 War, you have a problem.  A LOT of Jewish leaders have told the truth about who started it, ON THE RECORD.  Here's what the Jewish terrorist who founded Irgun and bombed the King David Hotel in Jerusalem (killing a LOT of British people), then went on to become Israel's Prime Minister had to say about it.  I'll type it very slowly so you can keep up:

“In June 1967 we again had a choice. The Egyptian army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.”

-- Menachim Begin’s address to the National Defense College, 8 August 1982 (check the government of Israel’s own Ministry of Foreign Affairs! www.mfa.gov.il)

yas
yas like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

@Hadrewsky You are a racist troll. Israel is a safe place eh? Im pretty sure the white journalists who got shot in their head close up by the IDF will disagree, as will the thousands of Palestinians murdered by Israeli bombs.

Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky

@yas

There are abuses that should be punished... nobody should be shot in the head.

Nobody should be harmed because of race.

RACE matter not a white! Faith matters.... I dont care what color the Muslim is, only that their sharia law be stopped.

Islam is the enemy... Faith is the enemy - Radical Jews are the enemy, but the Muslims are the larger problem.


Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky

@DonnyKnudsen @Hadrewsky

An ad-hominem attack is basically saying that you have nothing of value to say anyway.
The grownups are indeed talking and you are a monkey who resorts to flinging poo at an argument. grow up.

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Hadrewsky 

Go back to your X-Box.  The grownups are trying to talk about Israel's hideous human rights abuses that can no longer be tolerated.  Some of us will hope for a power outage in your area so you can read something (a daring presumption) that doesn't coincide with the story line of a video game.

Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky

Though any theocracy is stupid... I think the Christians are only a less blood thirsty version of the same type of idiots lead by the disease of faith/

FeebWillis
FeebWillis

Actually, the Holocaust was God's way of making sure that Israel was created.  You have things upside down and backwards.

R-U-SERIOUS
R-U-SERIOUS like.author.displayName 1 Like

There can never be a viable solution to this problem as long as either side has a hidden agenda and they both do. The sad fact is the West should have never created Israel in the first place. This was a bad decision made for all the wrong reasons. England and the U.S, can say what they want but the fact is none of the European Countries nor the U. S. at the time wanted all these Jewish refugees in their countries. If you believe in the word of the Bible then you would have to recognize that God Licked the jews out of Israel because they did not follow his  commands and only God can give the Jews back their country. 

The Western Powers tried once again to play God and as usual screwed it up. Now we must protect what we have created because the problem was created by us. Throughout history, was there ever a time when the Arab world was not at war with the Jews? I cannot think of one time. What makes any sane person think they can change that dynamic? If Armageddon comes it will start in the "Holly Land" and we have lit the fuse. God help us all!

FeebWillis
FeebWillis

@R-U-SERIOUS Actually, the Holocaust was God's way of making sure Israel was created.  You have things upside down and backwards.

jj.wyndham
jj.wyndham like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

@R-U-SERIOUS

I absolutely agree Israel should never have been created.

Prior to the beginning of Zionism and the massive immigration of Jewish people to Palestine, I know of no conflict between Arabs and Jews anywhere.  Ever.  I don't say this as a challenge or affront to you.  All I am saying is that based on what I know, the conflict between Arabs and Jews was entirely created by Zionism.

For example, David Ben Gurion was Israel's 'Father' and first PM:

"If I was an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: ***we have taken their country***.  Sure God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs. We come from Israel, it's true, but two thousand years ago, and what is that to them?"
- David Ben Gurion, quoted in Nahum Goldmann’s ‘The Jewish Paradox’, published 1976.  Goldmann founded the World Jewish Congress and served as its president for 26 years.

"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
-- David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985

 "Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."

-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech.

I can further back this up with evidence from prominent Israelis who left Arab countries to emigrate to Israel during modern times.  

“Any reasonable person, Zionist or non-Zionist, must acknowledge that the analogy drawn between Palestinians and Mizrahi [Arab] Jews is unfounded. Palestinian refugees did not want to leave Palestine....Those who left did not do so of their own volition. In contrast, Jews from Arab lands came to this country under the initiative of the State of Israel and Jewish organizations.” (Yehouda Shenhav, professor at Tel Aviv University and of Iraqi heritage: Ha'aretz, 8 October 2004)

 "We are not refugees, nobody expelled us from Iraq, nobody told us that we were unwanted. But we are the victims of the Israeli-Arab conflict." (Avi Shlaim, Israeli historian from Baghdad Ha'aretz, August 11, 2005).

Ran Cohen, member of the Knesset: "I am not a refugee....I came at the behest of Zionism, due to the pull that this land exerts, and due to the idea of redemption. Nobody is going to define me as a refugee." (Ha'aretz, 8/10/04)

The late Yisrael Yeshayahu, speaker of the Knesset:

"We are not refugees. [Some of us] came to this country before the state was born. We had messianic aspirations."

Shlomo Hillel, former minister and speaker of the Knesset: "I don't regard the departure of Jews from Arab lands as that of refugees. They came here because they wanted to, as Zionists." 

gaguy1967
gaguy1967

@jj.wyndham @R-U-SERIOUS You know of no conflict between Jews and Muslims before 1947? Youre a fool. There was a muslim massacre of Jews in 1929 in Palestine.Jews were always second class citizens under muslim rule.

Schmoogalicious
Schmoogalicious

@gaguy1967 @jj.wyndham @R-U-SERIOUS Um, thanks gaguy1967, for helping JJ prove his point since the 1929 massacre was well after the advent of political Zionism.  Try to show that there was a conflict between Jews and Arabs in Palestine prior to the European Zionist immigration that began in the late 1800s, OK?  We'll wait...

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen

@gaguy1967

You're a fool (just correcting you - you're is the contraction for 'you are' -- darn English language is tricky, I know).

And what was the precursor to that 1929 event?  You Israel-boosters have a remarkable ability to start and stop the clock at will, skipping over the parts of history that don't fit your one-sided view of events.

What you and your ilk ALWAYS avoid discussing is the fact that the whole mess in Palestine started at a Jewish conference in Basel in 1897.  I quote Israeli scholar Avi Shlaim, a professor at Oxford University:

"After the Basel Congress the rabbis of Vienna decided to explore Herzl's ideas and sent two representatives to Palestine. This fact-finding mission resulted in a cable from Palestine in which the two rabbis wrote, 'The bride is beautiful, but she is married to another man.'

…In its formative phase, under the direction of Herzl, the Zionist movement thus displayed two features that were to be of fundamental and enduring importance in its subsequent history: the non-recognition of a Palestinian national entity, and the quest for an alliance with a great power external to the Middle East. Bypassing the Palestinians was the trend in Zionist policy from the First Zionist Congress onward.”

That's why your ONLY fallback position is "god gave it to us two thousand years ago".  Take away the United Nations Israel uses or ignores, cafeteria style, and the entire State of Israel's "right to exist" teeters on this mythical contention that an increasingly secular world views with disdain.  If Israel does not get back inside the 1948 lines the UN defined, "The Jewish State" will cease to exist.  Israel can either be democratic (i.e. Arabs and Jews with exactly the same rights in a truly representational democracy) or it can be Jewish, with Jews running an apartheid state the world will not tolerate.  If you don't think a few hundred million goyim voting with their wallets can have an effect, you are in for a rude awakening.

R-U-SERIOUS
R-U-SERIOUS

Sorry the word "Licked" should be "kicked"

j.villain1
j.villain1 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

I love the way this article completely ignores the part of the United States in destroying the two state solution. The US signed UN Security council resolution 242, then every administration since has aided and abetted Israel in violating that resolution, the UN charter and the Geneva conventions.  

The reason why the US is so often targeted by terrorists isn't because you listen to disco music or have elections as your politicians would have you believe. It is because you are waging an illegal and unjust  religions crusade against Islam. The American people are dying for it, losing their constitutional rights for it and paying a massive bill for it. Isn't it time the American people demanded to know from their politicians why they are paying this massive price? What is in it for the American people? 

R-U-SERIOUS
R-U-SERIOUS

@j.villain1 Too bad you deliberately confuse two separate issues. One of which is absolutely false. The U.S. is not waging a war against Islam. We are waging a war against the extremist Islamic terrorist organizations that murder innocent people in the name of God for the sole purpose of forcing people into the most extreme and false interpretation of the Koran. I would point out to you that in the Koran the word peace is used twice as many times as the word war. If you are a Muslim then you obviously do not know your own religion. 

jj.wyndham
jj.wyndham like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

@R-U-SERIOUS

"The U.S. is not waging a war against Islam."

For the Arab world, perception is reality.  Look at all our media.  Everywhere the message is the same: Muslims are out to get us.  THAT is what is false.  Israel and its allies are responsible for a great deal of pain and suffering in the Arab world, creating the worst kind of enemy one can have -- i.e. an enemy with literally nothing left to lose.  

For the Arab world, they see Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, etc. and all the overt and covert operations conducted by the west that culminate in the killing and utter disenfranchisement of literally millions of their people.  To me, the surprising part is there aren't MORE of them angry enough, over the death of their children and destruction of their homes for example, to want to join radical terror organizations and seek vengeance.  For every 'terrorist' we kill, we invariably end up killing a lot of normal people just trying to live their lives.  How many of the survivors left to deal with the loss will be made angry enough to want to resort to terror, because their country is not powerful enough to take on the US or Israel militarily?  What's the ratio -- for every 'terrorist' we kill, how many do we create? Do we really think that Arabs will stop wanting to hurt us if only we kill enough of them?

The sanctions against Iraq leading up to operation desert stupidity killed over half a million children, before they stopped counting.  And now we're doing it all over again in Syria and with Iran, based on lies about WMD's.  

Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky

@yas

Saudi Arabia the cradle of Islam's holiest cities is built upon the hacked limbs of its "criminals" and the corpses it beheads and stones.

The nations Islam has built such as Saudi and Iran are full of the stink of corpses

yas
yas like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Hadrewsky @jj.wyndham @R-U-SERIOUS Where is your authority for this ridiculous statement that Islam condones hacking limbs? And don't make up some ridiculous verse from the internet where trolls sit and literally make up verses from the Qur'an, trying to tarnish the beautiful religion. the only reliable source is an actual hardcopy. Muslims are just as disgusted by the acts of those 2 savages who used the name of Islam to carry out their disgusting deed. don't blame Islam just as you wouldn't blame Christianity for Adolf Hitler's holocaust. He was a Christian. But hey, who am I to reason with someone calling for the nuclear gassing of the world's population. Nuff said.

nechemia47
nechemia47 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

What you speak of is the truth Americans have this vision if they destroy and kill enough radical Muslims it will solve the problem. They invaded and destroyed corrupted the middle easts most beautiful country Iraq and then just left it in ruins. What does that show to other Muslims who are being taken advantage of by there governments do we want the west to come and help us rid of out government? The Palestinian Israeli issue is one of its own with no logical and easy settlement plan. Israel was built with blood of both the Jews who came for a new life free of hate and anti-semitism they are here for democracy. The Palestinian wants the same freedom as the Israeli only his government doesn't offer that his government is corrupt and they are scared to fight Israel (the PA). Hamas is right for their cause but in a modern world you can't fight a nation like the Jews with a kalechnikov. The nature if man is hate the Arabs hate us for creating a modern and comfortable home on their land but more then that they hate us becouse we have what they want but won't and can't share it. Nechemia I live in Jerusalem I am neither a Zionist or a leftist just a man with a great vision for this wonderful land

Hadrewsky
Hadrewsky like.author.displayName 1 Like

@jj.wyndham @R-U-SERIOUS 

Could be because the rest of the world would not care if the middle east were turned into nuclear glass tomorrow... the oil is still there so hey.

and we would have finally have gotten rid of a faith that considers hacking limbs and stoning women to death to be 'peaceful Islam'.

The world is disgusted by Islam's "law" and so called "peace"

mrbomb13
mrbomb13

Doesn't matter what those "influential Palestinians" say...that solution will not happen during Obama's Administration.

Good luck with that wishful thinking mentality though.

EverettColdwell
EverettColdwell like.author.displayName 1 Like

If you want a great example of a successful binational state, just look north to Canada, where English and French have learned to live together in peace.

gaguy1967
gaguy1967

@EverettColdwell Liberal idiocy knows no bounds. Both French and English in Canada are westerners with western values. No, Muslims cannot even live with fellow muslims or Christians. Yet you think they can live with Jews.

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen

@gaguy1967 

All Muslims are exactly the same, right?  What would you call a person who made a similarly idiotic generalization about Jews?  Look in a mirror.

mrbomb13
mrbomb13 like.author.displayName 1 Like

Using Canada as an example of a "successful two-state solution" is misleading and inaccurate.

For one thing, when you refer to "the French [in Canada]," I presume that you are referring to the Province of Quebec.  While Quebec's independence movement has an established history, it has not been successful in gaining independence for the province.  Even though a substantial number of French-speakers inhabit Quebec, they are still tied to the nation of Canada.

Second, the provincial government of Quebec is in no way comparable to the Palestinian Authority (PA).  Quebec has a Western-styled system of secular government, whereas the PA is driven by Islam.

By logical extension, the Quebecois (a.k.a. those who live in Quebec) are in no way comparable to the Palestinian people.  The Quebecois are largely tolerant and embracing of different peoples and cultures.  On the other hand, some Palestinians still call for the death of Israel and Western society.  Such calls for violence would be rare in Quebec.

Lastly, the manner by which the English/French "learned to live together in peace" is completely different than the current dynamic between the Isreaelis/Palestinians.  The English/French share a similar culture, and similar philosophies on society and politics.  Israelis and Palestinians?  Common culture?  If you can find commonality, please show me where.

Given the above, it's clear that using Canads as a poster-child of a successful two-state solution is misleading and inaccurate.

Palerider1957
Palerider1957

When Israel became a nation in 1948, the arabs (you call them 'palestinians", no such race of people, never has been) had a chance to have their own country right then and there. They refused. Just as they have refused at least 3 other times.
It isn't about a "palestinian state" it is about ERADICATING ISRAEL! They [arabs] have been saying since 1948 that they will destroy Israel, push them into the sea and kill all the Jews [something you in the MSM will never report!]
And then there is the misnomer of "democratic state". You mean like the "Democratic State" that Egypt got? You know, the "democratically elected" Islamic State. No democracy whatsoever. Just like Libya, Yemen, Qartar, and quite possibly Syria. Just another islamic terrorist state.

fhmadvocat
fhmadvocat

@Palerider1957 You are living in a dream world.  The Zionists would never allow a Palestinian state on what was left of the British mandate of Palestine.  That is why the Zionists agreed to let Jordan absorb the West Bank, thus becoming "Trans-Jordan".  How do you think Israel survived with an area just 8 miles wide from 1948 to 1967 unless they were working with the Jordanian king?  Even today,the Israeli government is not interested in a Palestinian state next to Israel as a Palestinian state would always be an existential threat to Israel.  Why?  Because Palestinians would always make the claim to their ancestral land, and to acknowledge the existence of Palestinians would require Israelis to confront their country came into being by the force of arms and forcing the Palestinians to flee.  The Zionists conquered Palestine, often with bloody hands, which some in the United States would refuse to acknowledge.

Palerider1957
Palerider1957

@fhmadvocat @Palerider1957 NO YOU ARE. HISTORY records that the UN offered a State to the so-called "palestinians" (they are ARABS, mostly from Jordan and Syria) and the "palestinians" rejected it. Just like they have rejected a State 3 other times. Histroy proves it. So, whatever, Libturd liar.
And as far a "ancestral lands" BS!!
You better check dolt, all those "palestinian" towns etc, are ALL built on JEWISH (Israeli) ruins. Dating back to the time of Moses.
ANd where exactly is your "Dome of the Rock" located, ON THE JEWISH TEMPLE MOUNT!! JEWISH ruins, not arab.
And when Jesus returns, your little worthless shrines will be wiped of the face of the planet.
You see your lies (taqiyya) don't work with me. Nioe try though, infidel! HA HA HA HA he he he he

gaguy1967
gaguy1967 like.author.displayName 1 Like

@fhmadvocat @Palerider1957 The Israelis do support the creation of a Palestinian state. It is the Palestinians who do not recognize a Jewish State.

Palerider1957
Palerider1957

@DonnyKnudsen @gaguy1967 And don't forget EVERY SINGLE ARAB AND MUSLIM SWINE have sworn the destruction of Israel and the slaughter of ALL Jews "where ever they may be found".
Israel gave up Gaza for peace. What did they get? Bombed. Israel gave up the West bank for peace. What did they get? Bombed!
Yeah nice try Ms. taqiyya

DonnyKnudsen
DonnyKnudsen

@gaguy1967

If you actually knew anything, you might be dangerous.

A recent exchange at a meeting of Knesset's Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee:

"The government has not even decided that it supports two nations for two peoples," Chetboun told Livni.

MK Moti Yogev (Habayit Hayehudi) continued the thought, saying, "Two nations for two peoples is disconnected from reality."

Livni walked out.

Now deal with the fact the Likud charter still states the existence of an Arab state between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean is wholly unacceptable.

j.villain1
j.villain1 like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Palerider1957  

When the Palestinians applied for state status at the UN they did it on the basis of the 67 borders which would give Israel roughly 72% of the land. So stop with the hasbara.

jj.wyndham
jj.wyndham like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

@Palerider1957

Here is the so-called ‘Balfour Declaration’, IN ITS ENTIRETY, which the asinine ‘Levy Report’ states serves as the basis for Israel’s claim to ALL of the occupied territories:

"His Majesty's government views with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

Clearly, it is not the complex document the Zionist propaganda machine makes it out to be.  Note how its validity rests upon existence of a place called “Palestine” (established demonym "Palestinians"), with an indigenous, pre-existing population that enjoyed certain civil and religious rights Jews were not entitled to trample on.  So, if there is no Palestine or Palestinians, there is no Balfour Declaration, and NO ISRAEL.

Obviously, the Zionists’ practice of forced expulsions abrogated the part about doing nothing to “…prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine…”, rendering the entire ‘agreement’ NULL and VOID.

When it was established by Zionists in the region, "The Jerusalem Post" was named "The Palestine Post".  It is true that the word Palestine referred to a geographic region more than a formal country, but the same can be said of Israel.  Israel has internationally recognized borders established in 1948.  Israel continues colonizing areas outside those borders, contrary to international law, invalidating the established definition.  If Israel gets back inside those established borders, nobody can question its "right to exist".

You really should abandon this asinine claim that Palestine never existed.  In 2012, the UN formalized its existence and, deferring to a higher authority, Google also acknowledged the State of Palestine, causing panic in parts of the Israeli government.

j.villain1
j.villain1 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

@jj.wyndham@Palerider1957 

What the Israelis fail to mention every time they break out Balfour is the white paper that Winston Churchill released to clarify the intention of the Balfour declaration. In it he made clear that the intention was NOT for a Jewish state. You can read it here.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/brwh1922.asp

jj.wyndham
jj.wyndham like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Palerider1957

Yes, that's an excellent point.  The Avalon Project at Yale is a tremendous, factual resource.

I don't have time to look for it right now, but the British published another position paper before WWII (if memory serves correctly, it was 1937 or '38) wherein they make it clear they never intended a Jewish state that would be established by forceful expulsion of the indigenous population.  Accordingly, when it became clear that the massive immigration of Diaspora Jews was intended to accomplish that the very goal, the British forbade further immigration.

This led to the invigoration of Jewish terrorism in Palestine.  Simply stated, Jewish terrorist groups like Irgun (founded by Menachem Begin), Lehi, Haganah, and the Stern Gang used bombing and other terror tactics to encourage the British to abandon their Mandate so the Zionists could have a free hand.  These terror operations continued throughout the Second World War, culminating in the 1946 bombing of the King David Hotel in Jerusalem, where nearly 100 British died and scores more were badly injured.

Israel commemorates the King David Hotel bombing annually.  British personnel at the hotel received all manner of threats all day every day for years, becoming so accustomed to them they ignored the warning that fateful day.  In the Menachem Begin Heritage Center, a plaque commemorating the bombing blames the British for failing to heed the warning that day and evacuate its people.